SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Update:
I pulled the trigger and read my disclosure letter out loud to my BH last night. I’m not sure how things are going to go, but I’m continuing to try. I was not brave enough in my letter to admit it was a physical A, and talked more about the EA part of it, but I did admit that it was a LTA with the same person all this time. I’m going to talk to him about going to MC so we can dig deeper and work on things. I did not demand MC, but I brought it up in the letter and I’m trying to give him time to process what I read to him.

It was very emotional for both of us and painful of course. Neither of us wants to leave at this point. That may change when he finds out more details about the times it was also a physical A, but at least we have begun.

Thank you to those who have encouraged me to disclose and for all of your opinions no matter where they fall. I really do appreciate this forum.

[This message edited by dlvp at 5:25 PM, Monday, August 4th]

This was not the best move...

I do wish you had sought advice prior to delivery. What you did is called trickle truthing and is rightly described to be almost a form of torture to a betrayed spouse. I've read many threads suggesting the trickle truthing was in fact the worst element of the affair.

You should have ripped the bandage off, instead you're toying with him.

I'm sure many wayward and betrayed partners alike will speak to this.

@DRSOOLERS Yes I know this was not the best way to do this. You are right. I don't anticipate it being more than a day or so before the rest comes out. That is all I could manage yesterday. We are supposed to talk again tonight. In letter I said it was an EA that escalated but I did not go into details and he did not ask. I am afraid to talk more about the PA while I am alone with him. I want to go to MC to rip the bandaid off. I am sure that makes me a coward. But this is where we stand as of today. I have no illusions that I am doing anything right. I hear you.

I added this to the update on the post:
I did the best I could. I was afraid. And cowardly. I could not form the words about the physical element. I told him there was more to it but that I would like to talk about it in therapy. We are going to continue the conversation tonight. He said he has questions but wants a day to think. I WILL tell him everything. I am scared to death. I know to many I am a shitty person, I get it. But I am not going to be on here in this forum lying. My update is what happened yesterday. I will update more soon for anyone who is following.

Yes, currently you are being a shitty person. No getting around that.

The aim of coming here is to remedy that, if it at all possible.So I'm sorry if this comes across harsh but you need to grow some strength. You are not the victim here. You were the one who said you were ready to give this another go. You were the one who said you were ready to fight. You were the one who said you believe you are the best partner for him. Start acting like it. No more withholding the truth from now on.

You've betrayed your partner from weakness, to attempt to fix this you will need strength.

[This message edited by DRSOOLERS at 8:39 PM, Monday, August 4th]

@DrSOOLERS you are right. I will keep you posted for sure. We will be calling a MC today.

I was not brave enough in my letter to admit it was a physical A

Trickle Truth is a torture like none other.

I won't break out any 2x4 or even small twigs [as I would like to remain on this forum]. But you need to tell him the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth. Any deviation from hard truth is torture to him.

IMHO you are way too soon for MC. If you can't be honest with him, you have no M to C really. Because he does not have the whole truth - he'd be attending under false pretenses.

While we encourage making a timeline of the affair outlining all known details - it has to be truth. No omission, no trickling of information, but cold hard honesty.

Please, as hard as it will be for you, the truth must come out 100%. No detail omitted no matter how small.

If you told him your EA "escalated", I suppose he knows what’s coming.

I was not brave enough in my letter to admit it was a physical A

This lie by ommission is huge and has sabotaged any further effort before its even begun. Youve been told over and over that full disclosure is the only way forward, know in your heart that its true, and are choosing to continue the lie with a half truth.

Reengage him today and come 100% clean. Get all the poison out or it will fester. Time to grow up and step up.

ETA: This man deserves the truth. The whole, unabridged truth. Take a step into a new way of living by embracing integrity and by stopping the robbery of his agency. You need to embrace truth as much as he needs/deserves to hear it.

[This message edited by DobleTraicion at 5:42 PM, Tuesday, August 5th]

dlvp

Thank you for having the courage to come here and read our responses even if it's difficult for you. You are going in the right direction by wanting to make things right, and by seeking advice from others who have experience in these matters. Don't stop now!

Unfortunately the trickle truth damage is already done. You can't go back in time and fix it. The best you can do is avoid compounding the problem by continuing to trickle truth him. Each time he has to experience the pain of another lie, any remaining trust will be eroded further until eventually everything will be eroded away and there isn't even a foundation left to rebuild the trust upon. You might already be there, I don't know. Only he can answer this question. But if you continue down this path, you will for sure get there.

In my original response I recommended you write out a full timeline with all the facts as best as you can remember and just hand it to him. The reason I recommended this is because its easier to confess to the paper. Once it's all written down all you have to do is hand it to him, something that is likely easier than reading the whole thing to him.

I still recommend this. Write out a list of events (a timeline) in chronological order from start to finish without omitting any important details. Write a separate letter, or preface the list with you explaining that you weren't fully honest the first time and you want to make it right. Give what you have written to him. Then stick around to talk about it if he wants, or let him process if he needs to.

Don't get me wrong, don't tell him "everything". Omit the specific details of the individual acts, and maybe omit places as well. Things like this can become triggers that will torment him later.

For example, my wife told me that she and her AP had sex in hotels. She told me about one hotel specifically. We happen to live near that hotel, and now every time I drive past it I'm reminded of her affair. Things like that are not necessary to include unless he specifically asks for them. Hold nothing back if he asks for it directly, but first make sure he really wants to hear it.

Theevent,

My WW didn’t tell me which hotels, so now I try not to look at any nearby hotel (parking lots, too).

There’s no good answer for this, I’m afraid.

I’m now in a position to move away, and that’s what I’m going to do.

She wants to stay put; I don’t like to think about that, either.

Theevent

That's an interesting perspective, but I would argue that you can't fully consent to reconciling unless you have all the details. Are the cliff notes of the truth truly enough to make a complete decision about staying together?

I question whether an unfaithful partner has the right to determine which information they should withhold. Surely, if they desire a real, open, and honest relationship, everything needs to be disclosed.

Consider a scenario where she omitted that she had sex in their shared bed or home. Or imagine she omitted that they engaged in anal sex, a boundary her husband had previously respected. What if she became heavily involved in BDSM or threesomes without his knowledge?

Any one of these facts could be a deal-breaker. How can anyone presume that such information is meaningless and therefore sharing it will only ultimately cause deeper pain?

I've discussed this topic with people who've said they could forgive oral but not vaginal sex. The details matter. All for them. What is a deal breaker changes person to person.

Ultimately, if the only way you can stay with your partner is to live in ignorance of their acts of betrayal, it suggests that the relationship's foundation is too fragile to begin with.

I think your perspective is that from someone who was always going to reconcile and as such additional details only stood to make the process harder. My point is you are in no place to know if you want to reconcile with our these details. Bit of catch 22.

[This message edited by DRSOOLERS at 7:29 PM, Tuesday, August 5th]

Update ... thank you to those who pushed me. I am in full disclosure mode now. We are talking and I am telling him every detail that he wants to know. He has agreed to MC.

I have been re-reading comments from @DRSOOLERS, @Formerpeopleperson, @DobleTraicion, @Chaos today. All of it has been helpful, even the stuff that is hard to read. That is why I am here looking for help and different perspectives. We both know the marriage has a low chance of survival, and the trust from him is completely broken now because of my actions, but we are going to try. He is devastated, angry, and hurt of course, but as of now does not want to end the marriage without trying counseling first. We are establishing new rules and boundaries and I am focused on giving him whatever he needs, even if it means I have to go away. Right now he does not want that. This may change. I know it will be a roller coaster and touch and go for a long time, if not indefinitely. We will start next week with MC. I have zero illusions of success, but we both are saying that we don't want to throw away what we have built. So, we will try to repair and rebuild. If it has to end, at least we both will have tried to save our relationship. We are both scared but hopeful.

Thank you all for your help. I will be on here regularly. It has helped me to get real and to stop lying to my BH and myself. It has helped me to see who I was being, who I am being right now in this movement, and who I could be. Above all, I am ready to face whatever happens. Good luck to those who like me are struggling and trying to fix their lives, change themselves, and live authentic lives.

As a Wayward who is preparing to disclose a 4-year affair that ended 20+ years ago, I just want to say that I admire your courage. I wrote my initial disclosure to read to my therapist who specializes in betrayal trauma this week. I am targeting September 6th as DDay and I am really struggling. I was crying hard just reading it out loud to my therapist and thinking about the impact this will have on my wife is making me physically ill. My disclosure is for the one LTA and I am putting everything out in one setting, but totally understand the instinct to trickle truth. The comments about that seem harsh, but everything I have read, studied, heard, etc. is that it can make a horrible situation that much worse so fully disclosing the day after takes courage. I am very depressed and very hard on myself right now, but am on these boards and the reddit forums quite a bit looking for inspiration and although it took a couple tries for your disclosure I can draw strength knowing another person has made the difficult decision to be honest over a long-term affair.

[This message edited by feelingverylow at 9:57 PM, Tuesday, August 5th]

DRSOOLERS

I get what you are saying, but I also believe you have misunderstood my point.

I need to make a few things clear first though.

1. I was not "always going to reconcile", I knew from day 1 that I wanted to reconcile, that is not the same thing. There is a whole list of things that would have, and still might, cause me to exit the relationship. Only time will tell. Hopefully not.

2. In several infidelity recovery books I have read they also make this suggestion of not including specific details unless asked to do so. They include this suggestion as a way to not further hurt the betrayed spouse. This is exactly why I have suggested it. For example, I know that my wife had sex with her AP in several hotels. Do I also need the graphic image in my head of exactly what they did? Which room they were in, how it all wen't down? My personal experience seems to back up the cautions mentioned in the books.

I have asked my wife about the specific types of things they did, and how often. I asked her to take a lie detector test to give me confidence that her story was accurate. Apart from that, every detail she has included that I didn't ask for, or that paints an explicit picture, just causes more pain for me. Often when she would include these details it was for selfish, or defensive reasons, not because she was trying to be open with me. So in her case she WAS being selfish by including the additional details that I didn't ask for, and she ended up hurting me more because of this selfishness.

I question whether an unfaithful partner has the right to determine which information they should withhold. Surely, if they desire a real, open, and honest relationship, everything needs to be disclosed.

I wasn't suggesting she never divulge details. I was suggesting she give a high level overview, and if he wants the details make sure he understands it could be painful to know, but to give those details anyway if he asks.

In essence "we had vaginal sex in a hotel on this date", not "we wen't to dinner, held hands, started getting frisky by the window after a few drinks, he started unbuttoning my blouse...etc."

It should be up to the betrayed spouse to choose the level of detail they feel like they need, not the wayward spouse.

Are the cliff notes of the truth truly enough to make a complete decision about staying together?

The cliff notes give a place for him to ask questions if he wants more details. They should be fully complete, but not overly detailed in my opinion.